netphoria politics board

[revgoozen]

guys, i've been spending a lot of time there lately (only on that board), and i've come to the conclusion that it's vastly superior in many ways. in fact, the only passionate debate i've had on this board in a long, long time has been with a guy from netphoria? so the question i pose to you all, is what gives?

[Saxton]

We're not being properly moderated!

On a serious note, is the point of this board to have passionate debates? I don't like having those on the Internet.

[revgoozen]

Originally posted by Saxton
We're not being properly moderated!

On a serious note, is the point of this board to have passionate debates? I don't like having those on the Internet.

i follow up on every complaint that is mailed to me, and beyond that, i really only rarely edit/send threads to hell, because this board sees so little traffic as it is.

i'm not sure the entire purpose of this board is to debate, but i would say that debate should be a key componant in any political are philisophical discussion. i don't believe that you can really understand something unless you try and discredit it first.

[Barbara]

I think people tire of this philosophy board because a few of the most regular members/contributors have very specific viewpoints and beliefs they will not allow their debate to vary from, so people get frustrated and/or bored. or maybe that's me. But I've noticed ongoing debate/discussion from people of similar mindset a lot on here, whereas somone with a totally opposing view usually gives up and wanders away before things really get going.

[revgoozen]

Originally posted by Barbara
I think people tire of this philosophy board because a few of the most regular members/contributors have very specific viewpoints and beliefs they will not allow their debate to vary from, so people get frustrated and/or bored. or maybe that's me. But I've noticed ongoing debate/discussion from people of similar mindset a lot on here, whereas somone with a totally opposing view usually gives up and wanders away before things really get going.

yeah that's true, but at the same time, the people that i think you are reffering to, really carry minority opinions.

[dreamsofdali]

Originally posted by Barbara
[B]I think people tire of this philosophy board because a few of the most regular members/contributors have very specific viewpoints and beliefs they will not allow their debate to vary from, so people get frustrated and/or bored.

Or it's because the threads are all the same. Every time I come here (usually when netphoria is down) I see the same topics (i.e., does god exist, gun control, capital punishment). I can't remember the last time I've had one of those debates. I can see how, after a wile, people would get board of it and wander on to greener pastures. Netphoria has some posters that are completely rigid in their viewpoints but it's still different and entertaining debate with them. Maybe substance is what is needed.

[DrHibbert]

I can't keep up with the 10,000-word posts.

[Saxton]

So I feel like Indiana Jones' father in Last Crusade:

"So, I'm here now. What would you like to talk about?"

[Jackal]

I came up with some lame topics. But most I can think of have already been discussed.

[In Dust and Ashes]

Originally posted by revgoozen
the only passionate debate i've had on this board in a long, long time has been with a guy from netphoria?

what? since when?
:(
I mean nothing to you anymore.



and yeah, jackal, pretty much everything has been discussed already, but usually with some good variation. just don't make another thread to prove/disprove God, cus no one really cares anymore....
at least I dont
and I don't know anyone that does.

[Jackal]

Oh, no! I've learned my lesson! I'm not talking about God with you! :)

[In Dust and Ashes]

:rolleyes:

[Narcissistic Nihilist]

Im not here that much, and when I do see something new to discuss, Its already several pages long and I dont have the time to go through EVERYBODYS posts. Shame really.

[In Dust and Ashes]

it really is. when your about theres usually a good fight or an interesting debate.....usually the former.

I think this place has really calmed down a lot. some of it might be from loosing people, but I think a lot of us have gotten comfortable with eachother and our seperate beliefs, so we lack things to really discuss.

[In Dust and Ashes]

maybe I can leave and come back again as a rowdy extremist. how do you think that would go over?

[Narcissistic Nihilist]

Originally posted by hambakmeritru
it really is. when your about theres usually a good fight or an interesting debate.....usually the former.

I think this place has really calmed down a lot. some of it might be from loosing people, but I think a lot of us have gotten comfortable with eachother and our seperate beliefs, so we lack things to really discuss.
Yeah, but Im not hear to start fighting. Sure, I'll stick my two pence in, and see what happens, but there is no point me saying something which someone has said before, so I kinda have to read it all first.

For you my dear Jaquita, I shall make an effort to get here more often and post more, ok? :-*

Your second paragraph really does hit the nail on the head.

[In Dust and Ashes]

yeah, well I kind'a discoverd it's truth when I realized that no one is attacking me or laughing at me for my beliefs...except Jackal....but then she got chewed out by everyone else, so now even that is over.

[Narcissistic Nihilist]

I have always thought attacking someone for their beliefs is incredibly stupid, but then so is enforcing your beliefs on others. To take your instance, Jaqui, its as wrong for me to attack your Christianity as it is for you to try and make me a Christian.

Its an entirely personal thing that should have nothing to do with anybody else.

[Jackal]

I only attacked your beliefs as a defense mechanism. You have a way of wording things that comes off as not discussing, but putting down that person.

Example: when I said I didn't walk around late at night because I didn't want my breast cut off. refering to Jack the Ripper.

You came back with: He didn't cut their breast off.

That implies that I am stupid and wrong.

So then I had to prove that he did. And then you glossed over the fact that you were wrong.

I can be wrong and I'm ok with that, but in that instance there was no other reason for you to point out that I was wrong, because the whole JTR case in general could make a girl think about getting hurt. So when you said that I thought: "She's still trying to get under my skin."

I have stopped attacking your religion, and agree with NN, although it seems he's implying that I'm stupid.

[Narcissistic Nihilist]

Originally posted by Jackal
although it seems he's implying that I'm stupid.
You have given me enough reason to think so.

Dont take it personally, I think everyone is stupid unless they prove to me otherwise.

[Jackal]

I've seen hell and it's pages upon pages of arguing.

So there's no point in discussing anything with you.

[Narcissistic Nihilist]

Originally posted by Jackal
I've seen hell and it's pages upon pages of arguing.

So there's no point in discussing anything with you.
Youre right, it would all go over your tiny head.

[Jackal]

Predictable.

[In Dust and Ashes]

what's your point?

[Jackal]

Who me?

My point about what?

[Narcissistic Nihilist]

Originally posted by hambakmeritru
what's your point?
See just wants to prove how dumb she is. Its getting very dull.

[Herr Lipp]

Originally posted by hambakmeritru
what's your point?

That you tried it on with Allison because she isn;t a fucking bible-basher like you and she fuckng OWNED you and you ignored it. What a pussy. You must take tips from danny on cowardice.

[Jackal]

Thank You! LOL!!!!!:-D

[In Dust and Ashes]

Originally posted by Walter Sopchak
That you tried it on with Allison because she isn;t a fucking bible-basher like you and she fuckng OWNED you and you ignored it. What a pussy. You must take tips from danny on cowardice.

I tried what?

*ignoring lame put down on beliefs*

she owned me where?

and I've ignored a lot of this board recently because I have other responsibilities that take precidence over proving myself to a 30 some year old woman on a message board. as much fun as that is.... :rolleyes:

[In Dust and Ashes]

Originally posted by Jackal
I only attacked your beliefs as a defense mechanism. You have a way of wording things that comes off as not discussing, but putting down that person.

Example: when I said I didn't walk around late at night because I didn't want my breast cut off. refering to Jack the Ripper.

You came back with: He didn't cut their breast off.

That implies that I am stupid and wrong.

So then I had to prove that he did. And then you glossed over the fact that you were wrong.

I can be wrong and I'm ok with that, but in that instance there was no other reason for you to point out that I was wrong, because the whole JTR case in general could make a girl think about getting hurt. So when you said that I thought: "She's still trying to get under my skin."

I have stopped attacking your religion, and agree with NN, although it seems he's implying that I'm stupid.

is this what your talking about walter? is this where she OWNED me?
yeah, nice one...

lady, I"m talking about the first time you attacked my beliefs. to my recollection, it was your third post on the board and your first post ever to me. that's not defence. that's just rude.

second, countering you in anything does not imply that your stupid. pardon me, but it sounds like you have some serious inferiority complex. every time I ever say anything other than agreeing with you, you complain that I'm calling you stupid or whatever. get over it. it's a message board and I don't imply that your stupid. if I meant to imply that you were stupid I'd say:

"ha! yeah... your reeeeaaall smart :rolleyes:"

I didn't gloss over the fact that I was wrong, I acknowledged that on his last victim he ripped her to shredds. would you like me to appologize?
"yes ma'am, I was wrong...he did cut off a womans breasts....and everything else attached to her bodice."
it just seems that singling out her breasts being torn off is like saying "he cut her."

oh and I did give a reason for pointing all that out. I said I was immature and looking for a discussion. and yet you still complain??

[Jackal]

I don't think I owned you, or even cared to own anyone.

I'm not inferior to anyone on here, I'm picky about word usuage in relation to my post and if I think someone is putting me down or not understanding me, I do respond. I'm touchy that way!

[In Dust and Ashes]

no kidding.

in the old days you wouldn't of lasted more than 10 days.

I vote that the softness of the board is yet another factor why this place is boring.

[Jackal]

I don't know about that, I'm still here and I've been attacked plenty by many different people. I've been wrong, posted stupid shit, been called names, and been put in my place many times over.

I do care how my words may effect people. And I don't think posting shit on a messageboard to get a rise out of people just for my excitement is such a great thing.

I don't see the logical side of starting a conversation for that reason.

If I felt a need to see a bunch of people going at it, I'd watch Jerry Springer on paternity test day. At least I could see some punching and chair throwing.

[Jackal]

You've mentioned the lack of riveting topics on this board several times, so why don't you start some today?

[In Dust and Ashes]

can't think of anything worth bringing up. if I did, I'd post.

and I don't necessarily say junk to get a rise out of people. at least not like this. I was just bored and watned to see myself with words next to my icon. call me egotistical....oo! speaking of which, have you guys heard of the Burning Man festival? I read an article about it in rolling stone :-o
interesting stuff. I didn't actually get a chance to finish the whole article. I should go do that, but right now i'm too distracted.

Hey Rev. you know how I used to not finish discussions in threads? yeah, well now I"m not finishing anything :) it's cool and horrible at the same time......mostly horrible.

[Knight0440]

I'd like to apologize for my absense here and on netphoria lately. I've gotten really busy and am actually engaged in social justice stuff rather than arguing with people here. But maybe I'll come up with some down time soon to get re-integrated... oh well!

[revgoozen]

Originally posted by Kris K
revgoozen is a total douche.

done.

kris, please don't hate me. i want to learn how to be a completely worthless bigot, just like you, so that fat unwashed 14 year olds who get beat up in gym class will think that i'm cool, erm, KEWL, too.

[Narcissistic Nihilist]

Originally posted by Kris K
It's high time people recognize the severity of the Muslim threat to everyday life, and there's plenty of proof to back it up.
Now THAT is hilarious! :yes:

[revgoozen]

Originally posted by Kris K
Lets retrace what got you angry in the first place, shall we?

I call Peter a "fag," on the mod forum. I wasn't a serious claim at all, which I stated later. But nooooooo, you can't stop super PC revgoozen from throwing a temper tantrum and becoming the defendant for all minorties :(

to be angy, i would really have to give you more than a fleeting moments thought, and believe me dude, i don't (which makes you not at all different from anyone else on this board btw).

as for throwing a temper tantrum, i don't really think i did - but if that's what you call it when people present semi intellegent negations to your willfully ignorant point of view, then so be it.

none of this however changes the fact that my actions don't make you any more or less a bigot/idiot/asshole - only your actions have that power.

Originally posted by Kris K

So listen man. I'm not going to change my opinons on anything because it doesn't fit your distorted world view.
state for me if you can, what "my" world view is, and why you belive it to be distorted.

Originally posted by Kris K

Contarary to your popular belief, it's not America who is responsible for all the pain and suffering in the world.

when you say america, do you mean north america, south america, both, or do you just mean the US? in any case, it's pretty clear that you don't have any idea about what "my" world view is.

Originally posted by Kris K

It's not the white man either.
what does this have to do with anything? i'd find it incredibly entertaining if you could explain this to me...

Originally posted by Kris K

So go ahead and call me a bigot.
already have. you seem really concerned about it. if you are looking to change my mind, change your vocabulary - outside of that, you won't be very successful. if you don't care, then why respond? it's not as if i've sought you out to post accusations about your charecter.

Originally posted by Kris K

It's high time people recognize the severity of the Muslim threat to everyday life, and there's plenty of proof to back it up.

here we go again... do you ever hear a whisteling sound inside your head when you go outside on windy days?

[revgoozen]

Originally posted by Kris K
It would seem that you think America is the grand source of injustice in the world and the only injustices worth mentioning are those made by white men in business suits. [/B]

based on what? did you miss the fact that i'm a white american with a corporate job?


Originally posted by Kris K
US, moron :rolleyes: . As if you didn't know that already, either. [/B]

you should try to be more clear.


Originally posted by Kris K
You, amongst a lot of other people around here and most liberals only take action against something and call it out if it is an injustice which is orchestrated by the white race. [/B]

on what do you base this opinion of me.

Originally posted by Kris K
It's the same thing with Danny.[/B]
danny has nothing to do with this discussion. you are only trying to cloud the issue.


Originally posted by Kris K
If it's a senator hiking taxes it gets attention[/B]
if a senator stepped up to the plate and admitted that taxes needed to be hiked, i'd be surprised. i voted for clinton, who approved several tax hikes while in office. i believe that higher taxes are needed in the state of texas, where i live, to improve the quality of the public school system and various outreach programs.

Originally posted by Kris K if it's a terrorist blowing something up it doesn't get a mention from neither of you and when it finally comes to light it's percieved as racism. [/B]

since 9/11 terrorists have not blown much up in my country. i'm lucky for that. terrorists are bad. of course, not all muslims are terrorists. islam is as worth while an endeavour as any other religous pursuit.



Originally posted by Kris K
You know, I'm not really surprised that many of you don't understand it. You all don't live near cities which used to be nice and have low crime rates before the Muslim population grew. You can't relate.[/B]

true, i cannot relate to that. in my country though, when people make such arguments about say, race, i usually find that socio-economics play a greater role in civic deterioration than other, more superficial factors. of course, socio-economics cannot excuse criminal behavior. if you've ever seen me debate knight1234 you'd know how i feel about personal accountability.

[Narcissistic Nihilist]

Originally posted by Kris K
Prove me wrong, danny boy.
Ok, look at Iraq. No doubt the threat is posed by Christian nations on an Islamic country.

And your evidence is.....?

Oh, nowhere.

Not that is a surprise. :lol:


As the racist, bigoted ignoramous, it really is up to you to make your point, rationally and back up your claims. You havent done a thing, you just lie and whinge like a little girl. I have to admit it entertains me.

[Narcissistic Nihilist]

Originally posted by revgoozen
here we go again... do you ever hear a whisteling sound inside your head when you go outside on windy days?

[Narcissistic Nihilist]

Originally posted by Kris K
You know, I'm not really surprised that many of you don't understand it. You all don't live near cities which used to be nice and have low crime rates before the Muslim population grew..
No, thats because nobody did. Not even you.

I hate to use your primitive terms, but your beloved "white man" causes the terrorism by his oppresive foreign policy. People resort to suicide bombs because the West pushes them there. No one deserves to be attacked, but both 9/11 and the London bombings were expected due to their countries oppresive tactics. They werent CAUSES, they were REACTIONS to the causes of the West. The root cause of the terrorism is the oppression of the West. I fully expect more terrorist attacks, but thats the price we pay.

Im not retarded enough to blame terrorism on a muslim population that had as much to do with it as I did.

You really should actually learn something before spouting such shit, rather than becoming a reactionary fool yourself.

[Herr Lipp]

Those insurgents are as lily-livered as the fucking IRA. Not man enough to mount an army and fight and die for Allah's glory, they operate under the pretense that killing innocents (inc. their own) is somehow on the same level as fighting the enemy.

The IRA were fucking retarded, and so are these muslim cunts. It's not even as if they couldnt fight the Americans, look how many are still getting killed by the odd bombing or two. It's just theyre too weak, too fucking chicken to fight like men. Getting rid of Saddam was a good thing, and so fucking what if America had oil on it's mind. The West can't be held to ransom by some fucking brown skinned dictator who happens to own land filled with black gold.

[Herr Lipp]

But even so, I would like to see out boys back home. Iraq is not a place for teh civilised men of the Coalitions armies. Let those little towelheads have their fucking mosques and mopeds and filthy rags. Secure the oil fields and let Baghdad destroy itself again.

[revgoozen]

Originally posted by Kris K
Yeah Danny, terrorism and muslim violence all started when the US invaded Iraq :rolleyes:

actually the muslims have been fighting in some form or another before the crusades. in many of those wars, including the crusades, the muslims have not been the aggressors. this does not excuse all of their actions. are some muslims terrorists? of course. terror isn't exclusive to islam though timothy mcviegh wasn't muslim, he was christian. the kids from columbine were not muslim. i think you see where i'm going with this. we've had one example of a successful terrorist act in this country that has been perpetrated by muslims. that's hardly a strong indictment of everyone who believes in one of the largest religions on the planet.

Originally posted by Kris K

The US got rid of Sadammn. Sadammn murdered and opressed his people for years and years. We got rid of him, what's the problem? We're making it so they can have their own elections? What's the problem? Who's killing most of the Iraqi people on a day to day basis?The muslim suicide bombers.

we got rid of saddam. saddam was a bad guy. was it our responsibility to get rid of him? no. did 30K iraqis, most of whome were not combatants need to die in order for the US "to give" them freedom? probably fucking not. is freedom in iraq worth 1 american life? not in my opinion, no. and actually kris, you have no way to justify the remark you made about who kills more people on a daily basis. the US government has not released official figures of iraqi dead. as far as i know, no hard figures exist for the amount of dead due to acts by the insurgents. President Bush though, estimates that 30K iraqis have been killed by the coalition.

Kris, where do you live by the way?

[Narcissistic Nihilist]

Originally posted by Kris K
Yeah Danny, terrorism and muslim violence all started when the US invaded Iraq :rolleyes:

It's pointless to even argue with you because you're such a complete and utter moron who knows close to nothing unless it's about the Manic Street Preachers or football.

The US got rid of Sadammn. Sadammn murdered and opressed his people for years and years. We got rid of him, what's the problem? We're making it so they can have their own elections? What's the problem? Who's killing most of the Iraqi people on a day to day basis? The muslim suicide bombers.

Ah and nice comment about backing up claims seeing as YOU NEVER HAVE. You're just a great big ass who spouts out random bullshit at the second someone is blaming a different race or social class for something.

haha, and you're saying that I don't live in a town which has been polluted by Muslims? You've never been to my city, dumbass, how can you pass that judgement? Five years ago it was entirely different. There were small amounts of muslims living in the city and there was crime every now and then. Now we have Muslim gangs running around attacking people with hammers, selling drugs, and all sorts of things. They've ruined the community.
Who said it did, moron? Try and stick to the facts rather than your idiotic reactionary bullshit.

I know a great deal about of lot of things, yet you know nothing about nothing. Tragic, really.

The US replaced SADDAM with something much worse, and increased the risk to other countries causing such atrocities as the July bombings in London. They wanted war, they got war. What, do only expect one army to fight, dickhead? :lol:

I think you will find the illegal occupation of Iraq has now caused over 100,000 deaths. Far more than any suicide bomber thus making them far worse. Good to see youre still entertaining enough to get your facts wrong again :yes: Talking of which...

I have always backed up my claims where neccesary. Resorting to lies is very childish of you, but tell us something we dont know.

Considering it hasnt happened to any city, I dont need to know about your city to know it hasnt happened to yours. Any evidence to back your ridiculous claim up with? No? What a surprise. Youre just a liar.

[revgoozen]

Originally posted by Narcissistic Nihilist
Who said it did, moron? Try and stick to the facts rather than your idiotic reactionary bullshit.
100,000 deaths. where did this figure come from?

[Narcissistic Nihilist]

Originally posted by Kris K
Iraq didn't deserve to be attacked? What about Sadammn Hussein opressing and murdering his own people for so long? Should we have just let him continue to? Should we have tried to reason with him, Danny :lol:

Suicide bombings didn't just start happening after the US/Iraq war, dummy. Terrorism has been going on before that to. The Muslims not only hate us because we've been on their land they hate us out of strict religious reasons (ever hear of the Jihad, moron?). They won't stop until they have Muslim majority and Muslim rule.

It's not retarded to blame terrorism on the Muslim population when the crippling majority of terrorists are Muslim. Especially when their religion praises this intolerance and their actions.
No, it didnt. So the so-called "Butcher of Baghad" did bad things. That means we should go make it worse? What a fucking moron. Lets not forget the US put Saddam in to power to help their war against the Russians, so any atrocities he commited already put blood on US hands. The West were ultimately responsible for his crimes as well. A simple matter of protecting a free vote for the public would have been better than invasion. They had plenty of choices and chose the wrong one.

Why mention that suicide bombers started after invasion, reatrd? The Muslims dont hate anybody. They are far too big a collective to be generalised about except by idiots like you. They have never said anything about stopping till they have total Muslim rule. Stop lying, little boy.

It is retarded to blame Muslims when they are not responsible. So a white guy kills someone, does that mean you should be tried for murder too? You really are fucking dumb :lol:

Funny how you talk about intolerance, when you show more of that any Muslim I have ever known.

[Narcissistic Nihilist]

Originally posted by revgoozen
where did this figure come from?
apart from many reports and the media this month, there is an actual website with the updating death toll. Hang on..

[Narcissistic Nihilist]

put "Iraq 100,000" and the first entries all have it. This is the first...

here (http://www.alternet.org/waroniraq/20352/)

[Jackal]

I was pissed off on 911 and wondered why THEY attacked us. Then my husband explained why. I don't remember why now, but the U.S.A. did something wrong in the 1970's or something---anyone have a clue what I'm taking about?

I don't think Muslims would have just started bombing our military ships and American Embassies overseas without cause. What is the cause?

Was Sadaam a huge threat to the U.S.? I know he killed thousands of his own people, but why did our government feel we needed to stop him. Was he planning to attack us?

I admit to being a total idiot to everything relevant in world affairs. I ignore reality because I struggle to be happy. Ignorance IS bliss.

[Narcissistic Nihilist]

Originally posted by Jackal
I admit to being a total idiot to everything relevant in world affairs. I ignore reality because I struggle to be happy. Ignorance IS bliss.
Well there is always those more idiotic than yourself. Youve shown more intelligence in one post than Fraser and Kris have shown on the entire board!

[Herr Lipp]

good one danny. your jokes are getting funnier.

[revgoozen]

Originally posted by Narcissistic Nihilist
put "Iraq 100,000" and the first entries all have it. This is the first...

here (http://www.alternet.org/waroniraq/20352/)

"What is likely to cause considerable rancor in this new estimate is that most of the deaths reported were from U.S. bombing — nearly 80 percent — and not as a result of the insurgency."

so 80% from US bombing alone. then you have to figure that at least a portion of that number is completely accidental due to the environment. a portion would also probably be from natural causes. still more would be from other types of coalition combat. i'll be nice and say that as much as 15% might be from the insurgency, but that still doesn't prove Kris's point, at all.

who to believe? my figure, which came directly from GWB's mouth? probably not. Kris's blanket assertion which included no actual figures, source data, or anything resembling a cohesive thought process? probably not. i'll go with johns hopkins university.

thanks danny.

[Jackal]

See, I read that.

It's more than disturbing. I care that people are suffering, scared and dying.

Now I'll feel like a useless fool doing my stupid Christmas shopping later.

Now I feel guilty for having food, a family, house, fun, things to look foreward too.

[Narcissistic Nihilist]

Originally posted by Walter Sopchak
good one danny. your jokes are getting funnier.
That wasnt a joke. Wrong again, but then it wouldnt be like you to get it right now, would it.

Youre still struggling with facts, I see.

[Narcissistic Nihilist]

Originally posted by revgoozen
thanks danny.
No problem. And thats just the first site on the google.

Conclusive proof that the Western governments (let alone Israel)commit far more atrocities than the terrorists could ever dream of. It utterly destroys Kris's argument, but then those of us with intelligence knew that anyway.

[Narcissistic Nihilist]

Originally posted by Jackal
See, I read that.

It's more than disturbing. I care that people are suffering, scared and dying.

Now I'll feel like a useless fool doing my stupid Christmas shopping later.

Now I feel guilty for having food, a family, house, fun, things to look foreward too.
Its not a case of feeling guilty, but recognising those who are really responsible and not becoming as stupid as Kris and Fraser.

[Narcissistic Nihilist]

Originally posted by Kris K
It certanily seems like that's the situation you're trying to depict.



They replaced Saddam with democratic elections. I fail to see how that is worse. It didn't increase the risk to other countries either, the Muslims have always been in many countries around Europe, and there have been terrorist attacks in Europe before the war on Iraq. Common sense really, too bad you lack it.



Did you expect the war to be without casualties? In every war there have been a lot of innocent people killed in order for change. Wake the fuck up.


So no cities have seen crime rates go up because of Muslim immigrants? Danny, as I've said before, you've never been to my city, you know nothing about it. If you can find statistics for Mons, Belgium on the internet, be my guest. I couldn't. I don't need a fucking statistic, I can just walk out into the town and see it all happening.
Well unsurprisingly youre wrong again, moron. But then, it wouldnt be like you to stick to facts.

They have not replaced Saddam with democratic elections, they have replaced Saddam with something far worse. As so many Iraqis have said, at least they had jobs and houses under Saddam, now they have nothing. It has increased the anger of the Arab world and increased the support for terrorist organisation, so the threat to the West is increased by a huge margin, youre wrong again. Again, you trot out the irrelevance of terrorist actions before the war. I see you want to go over such illogical ground, because you dont have a point. Not surprising.

Wrong again. No war has to have innocents killed for things to change. I expect so-called "civilised" nations to follow the Geneva convention of warfare they created, not break it whenever it suits them. There is no doubt, it is the Muslims who are the victims here and the West is the evil power. Wake up to what? Your pathetic, ignorant and dumb fear? :lol: No, I'll stick to reality and the facts thanks. I'll leave cloud cuckoo land to you and your bullshit.

No, no crime rate goes up because of one particular set of people. I see you have no evidence, I call you a liar.

[Narcissistic Nihilist]

Originally posted by Kris K
No you haven't. You rarely do it and usually resort to name calling instead. Act your age you fucking moron.
The irony here is incredible. Do you realise how fucking retarded you are? Not just lying and saying I havent, but then showing the worst case of hypocrisy in 2 following sentences!!

What a fucking tool. Hilarious! :yes:

[Narcissistic Nihilist]

Originally posted by Kris K
Ah, and about the high levels of rape amongst Muslims http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=20535
Oh yes! One guy on trial is a "high level" of rape! :rolleyes:

You dumb, fat piece of shit! :lol:

At least your stupidity is brightening my day.

[Narcissistic Nihilist]

Originally posted by Kris K
Did you by chance miss this?




or this?



Remember Danny, reading the first paragraph of something isn't the same as reading the entire thing.
...and neither of which helps you. One is a report in Pakistan, one is merely a rumour.

Remember dickhead, just because some retard accuses someone doesnt mean its true. Wasted link. Unlucky.

[Narcissistic Nihilist]

Originally posted by Kris K
It's going to take time to rebuild a society. Are countries supposed to recover right away from a war? It takes time, you idiot. Your point is ridiculous. Oh, Saddam murdered thousands, was opressive, but at least people had homes and jobs! That's bullshit reasoning Danny. Typical liberal propaganda.



Innocent people have died in every war. There's no way you can stop that from happening. It's not as if the troops are walking down the street shooting at every Iraqi they see Danny. Mistakes are made.




You don't have any evidence to the contrary. Which makes you a liar and a fucking moron.
Its gonna take a long time because they fucked up from doing the wrong thing and going to war. Now, the damage can never truly be healed and the anger from both the Arab world and the West to the appalling invasion is only going to help the terrorists. Bullshit reasoning by the Iraqi's themselves eh? :lol: At least you cant claim that the invasion was for them now. It appears you have no idea what propaganda is. Merely citing proven facts is not propaganda. Unlucky again.

You can very easily stop it happening by not starting a war. Oh, and the troops were given license to shoot at anyone in Fallujah in Novenmber. Wrong on both counts.

No, I made a counter-claim. The burden of proof is on the positive. It isnt up to me to provide evidence, because Im calling the negative, and saying it doesnt exist. I call you a liar, and you cannot defend your claim, therefore your point is destroyed. Destroying your point does not make me a liar. Look the word up.

[Narcissistic Nihilist]

Originally posted by Kris K
Who cares if it's from Pakistan? How does that take anything away from it?
It has nothing to do with your very point about Muslim rape in Western society.

[Narcissistic Nihilist]

Originally posted by Kris K
IT DOESN'T FUCKING MATTER you moron.

Are you dismissing the fact that it's fucking horrendous just because it doesn't happen in Western society?
So youre saying your point doesnt matter?

You made the claim that rape and crime has gone up due to Muslim IMMIGRANTS. Now you are claiming that the fact is isnt immigrants doesnt matter?

Way to contradict yourself, retard! :yes:

[ramblingrose]

Originally posted by Kris K
Ah, and about the high levels of rape amongst Muslims http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=20535

Rape has been used as a weapon of war for centuries - there was systematic rape of German women by allied forces during/after WW2. It isn't exclusively used by any one group.
That isn't intended as a contentious statement, I'm merely pointing out that you can't use that as "evidence" to support your hatred of Islam.
Which I do find rather scary, to be honest. I respect your right to an opinion and I think it's good that in this country we do allow people to air their views, because at least then there is a chance of engaging in some kind of productive dialogue, but some of you are verging on "final solution" here.

[ramblingrose]

Originally posted by ramblingrose
in this country we do allow people to air their views

I meant anywhere with free speech, I know that's a relative concept but you know what I mean. (I thought this was a pub argument for a sec, sorry.)

[Narcissistic Nihilist]

Originally posted by Kris K
Where in there do you see me singling out Muslim immigrants?
Not there, but..
Originally posted by Kris K
So no cities have seen crime rates go up because of Muslim immigrants? Danny, as I've said before, you've never been to my city, you know nothing about it. If you can find statistics for Mons, Belgium on the internet, be my guest. I couldn't. I don't need a fucking statistic, I can just walk out into the town and see it all happening.

I thank you.

[ramblingrose]

Originally posted by Kris K
I'm well aware that it's been used in the past. It's looked back upon as being bararic and we do our best to keep it in the past and not let it happen again. However, many of these things we consider barbaric and inhumane are still being utilized by Muslims, which is my point.

But wouldn't any reasonable person agree that bombing civilians is barbaric and inhumane? Whatever your opinion on whether or not it's necessary doesn't alter the fact that is something which is still being utilised by the US military and their allies.

[ramblingrose]

Was that in response to me or Danny? sorry, I'm just trying to keep up.

[Narcissistic Nihilist]

Originally posted by Kris K
(to danny)

You're focusing on another part of my point.

Also, you didn't single them out when you asked me for proof, and I gave you an appropriate link. Stop bitching.
I didnt need to. That WAS your point. Your link gave a case of one person. That isnt evidence to suggest a "huge" increase.

[Narcissistic Nihilist]

Originally posted by Kris K
The US and it's allies aren't intentionally bombing innocent people.
Yes, they are. No need to look any further than bombing Al-Jazzera. Journalists are civilians.

Great sig, by the way :yes:

[Narcissistic Nihilist]

Originally posted by Kris K
Ok, I guess I was just day dreaming when I read in the link that Baird explained the series of high profile rapes in the area.
I failed to see any factual reports of who commited them, so whats your point?

[Narcissistic Nihilist]

Originally posted by Kris K
Yes Danny, I'm sure the US and allies were saying to themselves "lets go bomb these innocent people!."
thats pretty much what happens when the US military declares a "free fire zone" and declares a shoot anything that moves policy, so yeah.

[ramblingrose]

Originally posted by Kris K
The US and it's allies aren't intentionally bombing innocent people.

I think they call it "collateral damage"? They certainly didn't bend over backwards not to. The thing is, in war BOTH sides commit atrocities. Dresden anyone? I'm not saying that because that happened the US military are deliberately firebombing playschools and petting zoos, but I think it's a pertinent example. Wars are fought through propaganda just as much as military force, and it's important for each "side" to believe that their forces only act for good and any harm caused to civilians is accidental...but if the invading forces in Iraq really had gone out of their way NOT to hit civilians they'd have lost within about two seconds. You can't make an omelette without breaking eggs, and war is a right big omelette, like Rick Waller would make or something.

[Narcissistic Nihilist]

But they deliberately targeted civilians.

Like when Bush criticised Saddam for putting military installations in civilian areas, yet he still targeted those civilian areas, killing innocent civilians, and oh look! they was no military installations there.

They cut off food and medical supplies into Fallujah, to create panic and flush the insurgents out. An act of terrorism itself. This only led to the further suffering amongst the civilians and directly contravened the Geneva convention of warfare. They directly targeted ambulances making their way to hospital.

[ramblingrose]

I was trying to be "tactful" given that I don't have any references I could cite if I accused them of deliberately targeting civilians. I didn't think the Baghdad Blog would cut it as evidence really (y'all should read that who haven't already, very interesting).

Also, Kris, if you're at all interested in the history/psychology of rape as weapon of war, get yourself a copy of Against Our Will by Susan Brownmiller (about 10p from all good jumble sales), it's probably a bit hardcore feminist for you to actually want to read but the references she cites might lead you to some interesting material.

[revgoozen]

Originally posted by Kris K

They replaced Saddam with democratic elections.

hardly.
Originally posted by Kris K

I fail to see how that is worse.
you fail to see how killing 100K innocent people is worse than leaving a country that posed no threat to anyone outside of that region alone? kris, if you had a brain in your head, you would realize that 1. this is not a fair trade. 2. at the end of the day the people of iraq will still be muslims. 3. the people in power will be the more HARD CORE fire brand muslims. 4. iraq is destined to look more like iran as a result. 5. the unrest between tribes in that country is due in large part to idiotic british imperialism.

Originally posted by Kris K

It didn't increase the risk to other countries either, the Muslims have always been in many countries around Europe, and there have been terrorist attacks in Europe before the war on Iraq. Common sense really, too bad you lack it. true there have been all sorts of terrorist attacks throughout europe. terrorists who happen to follow islam have played a fraction of the part in those attacks.


Originally posted by Kris K

Did you expect the war to be without casualties? In every war there have been a lot of innocent people killed in order for change. Wake the fuck up.

spoken like a true terrorist.





Originally posted by Kris K

So no cities have seen crime rates go up because of Muslim immigrants? Danny, as I've said before, you've never been to my city, you know nothing about it. If you can find statistics for Mons, Belgium on the internet, be my guest. I couldn't. I don't need a fucking statistic, I can just walk out into the town and see it all happening.

so, kris, what you are saying is that youo are speaking out of your ass, that you really don't know what you are talking about, but that you like to argue. interesting.

[revgoozen]

Originally posted by Kris K
I'm well aware that it's been used in the past. It's looked back upon as being bararic and we do our best to keep it in the past and not let it happen again. However, many of these things we consider barbaric and inhumane are still being utilized by Muslims, which is my point.

1. rape is not at all exclusive to islam. 2. how does a high incident of rape in pakistan translate into it being alright to kill 100,000 iraqis who no one is accusing of raping or killing anyone?

[Narcissistic Nihilist]

Originally posted by revgoozen
the unrest between tribes in that country is due in large part to idiotic british imperialism.
MESS-of-potamia.

Lets not forget, Churchill was the person who was the first to be barbaric enough to bomb the Kurds.